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  #11  
Old 02-10-2017, 04:22 PM
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Gary Campbell Gary Campbell is offline
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Shannon...
The first artifact will be near impossible to probe with any level of detail. The knife handles could work, with final quality depending your modeling skills.

Have you done any time study on machining time for these products? I ask because you have said lots or hundreds. The artifact could easily take 5 to 20 hours to cut with a 1/32 ballmill, depending on resolution and stepover, but the knife handles could be done under an hour
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  #12  
Old 02-10-2017, 04:24 PM
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If you have 10 k buy the machine and out souce the file,, check with mezalik for a price or Brady,, yo may be pleasantly surprised,, I had a scanner and sold it to mezalik
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  #13  
Old 02-10-2017, 05:59 PM
Shannon Shannon is offline
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Thank you Gary and James.

So Gary, are you saying that, even on the knife handles, which really don't have any detail to speak of, that the probe MIGHT work, but even that is not certain? I have limited experience machining on the Stinger, so I am not that familiar with production times. I could live with 5 to 20 hours on a prototype, but not for mass production items. An hour or so for the knife handles would be OK, and maybe I could get it even quicker by using wider passes and then cleaning everything up on regular machines (belt sanders, etc.) I guess the main thing then would to find out if the probe would be the way to go to do simple things like these handles. As I said, the time to probe them is not an issue because I'm not going to be making only one or two parts from each probe, but rather hundreds at a time.

We watched a video on the EMS Creaform and it looked great, until we saw the price ($50K). Ouch. Can't do that. Not even close.

James, if I had an occasional piece to scan, your suggestion to send it to someone with a scanner would probably be the best option. However, we will have new things (like a slightly different shaped knife handle for instance) come up all the time, and it would quickly get to be a hassle. Much better for us if we could get set up to do it in house. I think though if we have something with fine detail, we could send it out to Brady if he would do it. We saw the link of the Morgan Dollar project. Absolutely amazing!

So, I guess what this all boils down to is, would a probe be a viable option for doing something as simple as the knife handles, where we need to do more than a 2D perimeter scan? (The main attractiveness of the probe being the price of course). And if the probe will not work well, does anyone have a suggestion for a decent 3D scanner for preferably around $1K which will do objects around 5" x 5", or is getting something like that for $1K out of the question? As I said, I can pay more if absolutely necessary but I certainly have plenty of other things I need to spend my money on at the moment.

Thanks.
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  #14  
Old 02-10-2017, 07:22 PM
Charlie_L Charlie_L is offline
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I'm the novice here but if I was thinking about anything involving production like for this item I would figure out a way to do it with mostly 2 d profile cuts. Use a photo for the outline profiles and rivets, etc. Then some 3d modeling where needed. Seems like it might be possible?
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  #15  
Old 02-10-2017, 08:16 PM
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Gary Campbell Gary Campbell is offline
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Shannon...
We are now in the part of the conversation where you are asking the same question in a slightly different way and are expecting a different answer.

RE: the knife handles you show above: The top one can be modeled or maybe probed. Results will depend on your skill level. Take the probe with a .030" tip on a COARSE .030 grid pattern.

Probe area 2" w by 6" long by 3/4" deep on .030 = 13400 probe points
1 point per second = 223 minutes or roughly 3.7 hours. You now have a low resolution scan. You now need to bring into another software, clean up and prep to import into Aspire. A much cleaner model could be generated for that part. Contact Michael Mezalick if you don't have modeling skills.

The bottom one with checkering cannot be probed with good results.

I would suggest that you pay a few $ and have your first few models professionally scanned, I also recommend Brady Watson. His scanner is in the $15-20K range AND more than that in software and the mega-pewters to run it.

Here is where I do you a favor:
"So, I guess what this all boils down to is, would a probe be a viable option for doing something as simple as the knife handles?"

Answer is a resounding NO! And the reason is that you cannot get a high enough resolution from it to turn out a decent product, especially on a beginner's skill level. It's slow and not the correct tool for the job.

I have not owned a scanner, so I withhold comment on them. I try never to offer opinion or advise on anything I do not have personal first hand experience with. A bit unique in this social media world
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  #16  
Old 02-11-2017, 12:25 AM
mclimie mclimie is offline
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Tons of undercut on that detailed one, so that isn't happening on a 3 axis. Even if it could, Gary's numbers are right on, especially with CAM software us regular folk have access to. If you spent big seat money, you could then get into optimized tool paths (i.e.: not always parallel) and/or re-machining so you don't have to run the whole finish pass on a teeny tiny bit, but then the learning curve is ginormous.

That micarta handle looks like a labor of love, not profit. Seems hand shaped to me. 3D machining it will kill the profit potential.

Given the number of passes involved in 3D, the tiniest tweak can halve or double your time (and we are talking about hours here), and decisions you make early in the process can really creep up and bite you. Finding that sweet spot with minimal post is both a science and an art.

I'll echo the recommendation for sticking with 2D (and some 2.5D) passes with different mill profiles to achieve the effect you're looking for. MUCH less manual cleanup, MUCH quicker to cut, even with tool changes, and who knows, you may end up with a unique product to differentiate you.

Marc
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