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  #1  
Old 12-26-2018, 10:05 PM
tbrookins tbrookins is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Warsaw Indiana
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Default Moved My Hurricane

When I purchased my machine second hand, it didn't have a filter on the hurricane and was mounted under the machine. After reading about how critical a filter is, I decided to add it. I recently moved into my new shop and planned having a utility room with insulated walls adjacent to my CNC room to cut down on noise.

Today was the day!! It took me all day but I got it moved. I wired the switches thru the wall so I can turn them on from the CNC room. I also made a base for the vac to sit on with holes cut to allow airflow. This base alone cut down on the noise quite a bit.
One thing I'm a little concerned with though, When the vac was mounted under the machine, I was pulling 9 hg. After moving it, and adding a filter, Im now getting about 7.5 hg. Is that normal? I did add a filter and 2 90 deg bends so It might be.

This area of the forum is for vacuum and dust collection. so I added a picture of my new Onieda Super Gorilla. I love it!
Attached Images
File Type: jpg hurricane.jpg (91.0 KB, 103 views)
File Type: jpg hurricane2.jpg (65.3 KB, 99 views)
File Type: jpg gorilla.jpg (93.8 KB, 107 views)
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Tracy Brookins

Stinger I
FTC & Laser
T-track
Kent Dust Shoe
Recoil

Stinger II 48x48
1.7Kw spindle
Kent dust shoe
Phenolic top with Hurricane vac & T-track
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Aspire 9
WinCNC
Logictech Rumblepad

Warsaw Indiana
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  #2  
Old 12-27-2018, 09:17 AM
Jim Becker Jim Becker is offline
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That turned out really well...you're going to enjoy having the "noise makers" in a separate space like that. I know it made a huge difference in my shop when I put my cyclone and compressor in a sound reduced closet a number of years ago. Good idea with the box under the vacuum system, too.

Not sure on the reduction in vacuum...check carefully for leaks, of course. Perhaps others have more ideas.
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SR-44 (2018), 1.7kw spindle, Performance Premium, USB, Keypad, T-Slot table (y-axis configuration), WinCNC, VCarve Pro upgraded to Aspire

Non CNC stuff...

SCM/Minimax - slider/JP/BS
Festool "a good collection"
Stubby - lathe
Oneida Cyclone
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  #3  
Old 12-27-2018, 07:29 PM
John B John B is offline
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I can't speak to the potential impact of your (almost 17%) loss in hg...but, in the event that it becomes problematical, I would make the following observations:

Using 4 of the 45 degree fittings with a short straight pipe between each pair would give you less drop than 2 of the 90's.

I don't know if that would be an improvement over a "long turn 90 degree elbow" or not, but either would be better than the "hard 90 degree turns". Both would require rearrangement of your machinery to accommodate the "longer turns" (or maybe just a new hole in the wall).

Your filter is bound to have produced some drop. What does it read with it (temporarily) removed?

I assume you cleaned and deburred all your joints (internally) instead of slapping them together as if it were a waste vent system in a house. Anything to reduce turbulence within the pipe is helpful.

I'm intrigued by your cyclone with the barrel dolly under the waste can. What is your process for emptying the can? I'm wanting to hard-pipe my (not yet purchased) cyclone receiver (that then feeds out to a separate dust collector) into the 6" dust collector main and am not fond of the idea of removing the ducting to empty the barrel.
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  #4  
Old 12-27-2018, 07:55 PM
Jim Becker Jim Becker is offline
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John, the bins with the Oneida cyclones have a "traditional" clamping type top on the barrel that keeps it 100% sealed which is imperative. To empty, release the clamp and pop the top. In the OP's case, gently lifting the top so it disengages from the barrel after unclamping, allows the barrel to be wheeled away on the dolly. I use a 55 gallon barrel with mine, but do not have a dolly. I don't have enough headroom for that and the motor of my Oneida cyclone is already up between the joists.
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Jim Becker

SR-44 (2018), 1.7kw spindle, Performance Premium, USB, Keypad, T-Slot table (y-axis configuration), WinCNC, VCarve Pro upgraded to Aspire

Non CNC stuff...

SCM/Minimax - slider/JP/BS
Festool "a good collection"
Stubby - lathe
Oneida Cyclone
more...

Retired from full time work in the telecom industry 9/2017
Commission work for equestrian tack storage and other custom furniture and cabinetry
Located Bucks County PA
http://bvww.us
bvww.etsy.com
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  #5  
Old 12-28-2018, 12:57 AM
John B John B is offline
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Default Wrong thread, I know...but since we're discussing...

Gerry

I'm actually thinking in a slightly different direction at the moment. The cyclone I'm looking at is at the link that follows--- http://cycloneseparator.com/store/pr...t-on-the-right

Based on the second photo from the right in the pictures below the main photo, it doesn't seem to matter what size or shape the dust receptacle is. If the "wheeled box" approach actually works, this opens up a world of possibilities ranging from a huge compartment within my "closet" (which would best be emptied with a grain scoop) down to a more manageable container size that could actually be taken outside to be emptied. With the former approach, I'd just lay a tarp on the floor and rake the box contents out onto a tarp and drag it 10' to the door, then outside (I have 2.14 acres of South Texas dirt at my shop location that would benefit from that mulch

Since I have the luxury of 10' of headroom below the joists, I have a lot of leeway in how I build this (however high it is off the floor,) my mainline 6" duct will be coming DOWN from the ceiling to feed the side inlet...the branch to the CNC will come in off of a Y just before the cyclone inlet, then reduce to 4" shortly before it goes through the wall into the CNC room.

My only concern with building a large box (as shown) is that, "nothing being free", there's bound to be some hg drop associated with the receptacle (that may or may not increase with the size of the receptacle). I've read that you can expect a drop of about 2 hg from any cyclone that's placed between the mainline and the (separated) dust collector. What I'm unclear on is...how much of this is "lag" (until the tightly sealed box is evacuated) and how much is "permanent"?

My heaviest load will likely be the twin 4" ports on my 24" drum sander, but that's really fine stuff. Other than that...10" table saw, band saw (TBD), radial arm saw, jig saw, router table, helical head 15" planer & straight blade 6" joiner will round out the product mix. With the CNC going, there will only be a maximum of one of these other tools running at the same time and duct length to the "heavy players" will be quite short and all but the cnc, jointer & planer will pretty much be "light load, short burst" contributions. I'm counting the cnc as "light load, continuous stream". I'm starting with a (nominal) 2300 cfm, but we all know how unreliable that number is.

Any thoughts? Anyone?
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  #6  
Old 12-28-2018, 10:50 AM
Jim Becker Jim Becker is offline
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John, I clicked on that link and honestly, just the initial photo with hard-bend 90 duct work tells me that those folks have minimal dust collection knowledge. The same is repeated in other photos. It's also a short-cone design which is less efficient in separation than a long-cone cyclone. The price is certainly attractive, but that's just for the separator...you have to build everything else. You also cannot achieve 2300 CFM through 6" duct...it's physically impossible to move that much air through the duct at typical velocity levels. Don't be fooled by the blower's marketing numbers...you have to look at actual fan curves and many of the mass market blowers do not have those available. For good reason. ;)

If you do decide to go that route rather than one of the established commercial suppliers like Oneida or Clearvue, be sure that you set you set your expectations realistically and install efficiently.
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Jim Becker

SR-44 (2018), 1.7kw spindle, Performance Premium, USB, Keypad, T-Slot table (y-axis configuration), WinCNC, VCarve Pro upgraded to Aspire

Non CNC stuff...

SCM/Minimax - slider/JP/BS
Festool "a good collection"
Stubby - lathe
Oneida Cyclone
more...

Retired from full time work in the telecom industry 9/2017
Commission work for equestrian tack storage and other custom furniture and cabinetry
Located Bucks County PA
http://bvww.us
bvww.etsy.com
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  #7  
Old 12-28-2018, 12:03 PM
John B John B is offline
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Default Dust

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim_in_PA View Post
John, I clicked on that link and honestly, just the initial photo with hard-bend 90 duct work tells me that those folks have minimal dust collection knowledge. The same is repeated in other photos. It's also a short-cone design which is less efficient in separation than a long-cone cyclone. The price is certainly attractive, but that's just for the separator...you have to build everything else. You also cannot achieve 2300 CFM through 6" duct...it's physically impossible to move that much air through the duct at typical velocity levels. Don't be fooled by the blower's marketing numbers...you have to look at actual fan curves and many of the mass market blowers do not have those available. For good reason. ;)

If you do decide to go that route rather than one of the established commercial suppliers like Oneida or Clearvue, be sure that you set you set your expectations realistically and install efficiently.
Thanks Jim.

What I see in the photos is a textbook case of bad design that's probably "user acceptable" due to the fact that there's minimal stuff connected and they are (in most cases) "bringing the collector to the work" and thereby minimizing duct length. Flex hose has four times the resistance per foot of rigid conduit of the same diameter. If all they're looking for is 400 cfm, they probably get that (or something close) from these (ugly) installations.

My approach to this was to try to use what I have and bring things up to snuff. (I already own the Grizzly 1030, bought used and not yet installed by me). I found these folks in the course of looking for a cyclone with a 6" inlet.

I'd already decided to "give this one a pass", based on the simple fact that, when I went to call them to inquire about SP loss associated with this cyclone, I was unable to find a phone number anywhere on their website (or anywhere online) and the only contact is a generic email address at a " dot rr" email provider. Ain't gonna go there.

Even though I'm putting this in a sealed room with outside exhaust, 30 microns is ridiculous ...expense of new 2.5 micron bags. The inlet plate on my machine is 6" x (3 x 4") versus the 7" x (3 x 4") on the current model. Then there's the absurd 18 amp power draw (vs. 11 -12 amps on the current motor with the same rpm). Somehow, Grizzly has assigned the same cfm of 2300 and the same maximum SP of 16.7 to both machines. That right there tells me that, unless there's a huge difference in the (current) aluminum impeller vs. the (old) steel one, that both measurements were taken with NO inlet cover plate and the machine running "wide open".

I'm gonna keep looking around, with an eye toward replacing this beast entirely with something that makes more sense...hell, I could buy two of their current model for about $1,000 (and draw 22-24 amps in the process), but I'm not going there.

I may end up with a low power (not a shop vac, something more in a wall mount type) unit that will run economically for hours on end and dedicate that to the cnc and put in something with a little more "oomph" to handle the rest of the shop.
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  #8  
Old 12-28-2018, 12:22 PM
Jim Becker Jim Becker is offline
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Yes, be wary of DC performance claims from mass marketers...the bigger Griz cyclones seem to perform pretty well based on user comments.

There's a 5hp Clearvue for sale in the SMC Classifieds right now in VA and a Oneida 2hp up in Vermont
__________________
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Jim Becker

SR-44 (2018), 1.7kw spindle, Performance Premium, USB, Keypad, T-Slot table (y-axis configuration), WinCNC, VCarve Pro upgraded to Aspire

Non CNC stuff...

SCM/Minimax - slider/JP/BS
Festool "a good collection"
Stubby - lathe
Oneida Cyclone
more...

Retired from full time work in the telecom industry 9/2017
Commission work for equestrian tack storage and other custom furniture and cabinetry
Located Bucks County PA
http://bvww.us
bvww.etsy.com
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  #9  
Old 12-29-2018, 12:32 PM
tbrookins tbrookins is offline
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Location: Warsaw Indiana
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Thanks for the feedback guys!
I closed all 4 of my gates on the Hurricane and of coarse the Hg was back up to 10. Then I looked for leaks.. none.. So I resurfaced my bleeder and boom!! I'm holding right back over nine.

Most of this discussion has been over dust collection. I could not be happier! I spent the extra money when I moved into my new shop and do not regret it at all! I have all metal duct work throughout that I purchased from Oneida. My shop stays very clean by removing the dust from the source.
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Tracy Brookins

Stinger I
FTC & Laser
T-track
Kent Dust Shoe
Recoil

Stinger II 48x48
1.7Kw spindle
Kent dust shoe
Phenolic top with Hurricane vac & T-track
FTC & Laser

Aspire 9
WinCNC
Logictech Rumblepad

Warsaw Indiana
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